Friday, May 04, 2012

A Mischievous Defense-Inspired Global Hoax - To Deflect From Some Bad News?

Posted by Our Main Posters

[Left, editor Chris Blackhurst of the Independent, right, editor Tony Gallagher of the Daily Telegraph]

1. Examine first some key happenings at the Knox/Sollecito trial

Throughout the trial which began back in January 2009 the defense teams often seemed down or depressed or distracted or floundering.

Reports surfaced in Italy that one or two of them might even have considered walking. Knox defense counsel Luciano Ghirga was reported as nodding off or distracted. Sollecito defense counsel Giulia Bongiorno was photographed seemingly showing some exasperation with Sollecito and at zero notice she missed several days in court.

Amanda Knox’s testimony over two days on the stand in June 2009 was widely seen in Italy as a disaster. From then on many in the court and throughout Italy believed this seemingly callous, evasive, forgetful girl had to have had a role in Meredith’s death.

Having failed to attend to observe any of the key forensic tests at the Scientific Police labs in Rome, the defenses were able to introduce some forensic witnesses who testified that there might, possibly, somehow, be contamination in the collection and tests which they chose not to witness, but they never came close to showing how.

By the summations in November 2009 both defenses seemed to be seriously floundering. 

2. Fast forward to Friday 20 November 2009

What happened on 20 November might well have made it the defenses’ very worst day.

On that day during their summation the prosecution BEHIND CLOSED DOORS devoted an entire day to reconstructing how Meredith died and the events in the few hours before and since.

The presentation was closed because Judge Massei had ruled in favor of Meredith’s family to close the court to the media when any upsetting material was being presented. For example the results of the autopsy had been presented in closed court.

This resulted in the Massei judges and jury receiving a much more disturbing picture than the Italian public and especially the foreign publics ever did.

The Italian media pieced together what had been presented behind the closed doors on 20 November and Il Messagero and several other Italian newspapers published it several days later. You can read a combined summary in this post here.

To our knowledge none of that summary of events ever appeared in the US or UK media, so the full impact of the reconstruction felt by the jury and to a lesser extent by the Italian public was never felt at all by the US or UK publics.

This excerpt is from that post:

We have left out the depiction of the final struggle with Meredith, which is extremely sad and disturbing. In the evidence phase this was testified-to behind closed doors at her family’s request and we have never posted anything from those sessions….

23:21 - Amanda and Raffaele go into Meredith’s bedroom, while Rudy goes into the bathroom.

23:25 - A scuffle begins between Amanda, helped by Raffaele, and Meredith. The English girl is taken by the neck, then banged against a cupboard. Rudy Guede enters and joins in.

23:30 - 23:45 Depiction in the timeline and computer simulation of a horrific struggle with Meredith

23:50 - Amanda and Raffaele take Meredith’s mobile phones and they leave the apartment. Guede goes into the bathroom to get several towels to staunch the blood, then puts a cushion under Meredith’s head.

That simulation video was a second-by-second depiction of what the crime-scene specialists from the Scientific Police in Rome had concluded, from the position of Meredith’s body in the room, evidence traces and the placing of various objects, and the many wounds described in the autopsy.

It was extremely difficult and laborious to get just right, and every tiny movement of the four that it depicts in three-dimensional space had to be able to stand up unchallenged - as they did.

The fight with Meredith took a horrific fifteen minutes. It only ended when she was lying bleeding on the floor, her hands grasping her neck. She was locked in her room to die, with her keys and phones removed to make sure she could not save her own life.

This was not a minute or two of hazing and a slipped knife. The evident intention was to see her dead - and in the reconstruction it required THREE ATTACKERS to explain all the evidence points.

The prosecution never entered the video into evidence so it could not be leaked to the public (the Sollecito family already stood accused of leaking one video)  but the effect on the jury seems to have been profound and the defenses could do nothing to blunt it.

The lone wolf theory was well and truly dead in that courtroom and a perception of three attackers was well and truly alive. The defenses did what they could in their summations but they were unable to shake the perception of a depraved three-against-one attack.

A few days later a verdict was announced. By a UNANIMOUS verdict Sollecito and Knox were found guilty.

3. Fast forward to the first-level appeal before Judge Hellman in 20011

Judge Sergio Matteini Chiari, the most senior judge in the criminal division, was appointed to preside over the appeal.

He was very experienced at presiding over murder trials and appeals. What happened next surprised many among the judges and prosecutors and Italian reporters and the Italian public generally. From the Italian Wikipedia:

Although the Assize Court of Appeal was to be chaired by Dr. Sergio Matteini Chiari, Chairman of the Criminal Division of the Court of Appeal in Perugia, in circumstances not well understood Dr. Claudio Pratillo Hellmann, who chairs the Labor Chamber of the Court, has been called on to preside over the appeal court,

The judge to the side of the main judge, Dr. Massimo Zanetti, came from the Civil Section, and both had had limited experience with criminal trials both rather remote in time (only the cases of Spoleto and Orvieto).

Judge Hellman readily consented to the defense requests. First to re-examine several witnesses previously heard on the stand during trial (primarily Mr Curatolo) and two new ones (Alessi and Aviello) intended to show that Guede or Aviello’s missing brother could have attacked Meredith with unknown others.

And second to appoint two independent experts who would re-examine the DNA on the large knife found in Sollecito’s apartment and the DNA for which traces were collected in Meredith’s room and the methods used for processing them.

The examination of the witnesses seemed to end indecisively, but the vague suggestions of the independent consultants that there COULD have been DNA contamination - never proven - was accepted readily by Judge Hellman.

The reconstruction and the showing of the simulation which the trial jury sat through in later 2009 was not repeated by the prosecution at the first appeal in late 2011. Judge Hellman showed no inclination to sit through the full depiction of the day or the horrific 15-minute attack on Meredith.

So the explanation of all the evidence points in the room and on Meredith’s body was never solidly brought home solidly to Judge Hellman or his jury. In his verdict he overturned the outcome of the first trial, provisionally pending any Supreme Court ratification, and he handed Amanda Knox a three-year sentence for framing Patrick Lumumba.

Having refused to see the reconstruction, he could very torturously argue that the attack on Meredith could have been carried out by a single person. If he and his jury had actually watched the video, they could never have argued that.

4. Fast-forward to the grounds of Dr Galati’s appeal to the Supreme Court

The Umbria Chief Prosecutor’s grounds for appeal were spelt out by him at a new conference in Perugia on Monday 13 February 2012. The PMF translation team will soon have the full document ready in English.

The summary of the grounds for appeal below is translated from the Umbria24 report and to our knowledge NO English-language website except this one and PMF has ever reported what are the full grounds.

Meredith case: the prosecution appeals to Cassation: the acquittal verdict should be “nullified”.

For the Chief Magistrates of the [Umbria] Prosecution, “it was almost exclusively the defence arguments which were taken heed of”

By Francesca Marruco

The first-level conviction verdict was “complete and thorough” while the verdict of the second-level is “contradictory and illogical”.  For this reason, the General Prosecution of Perugia asks the Cassation to revoke or invalidate it.

“We are still extremely convinced that Amanda and Raffaele are co-perpetrators of the murder of Meredith Kercher” said the Chief Prosecutor of Perugia, Giovanni Galati and the Deputy Chief Prosecutor, Giancarlo Costagliola.

Verdict that should be revoked “The second-level verdict should be annulled/revoked….  There are precise reasons for revoking it”, Mr Galati went on to say. In the Hellman reasoning report on the verdict with which the second-level judges acquitted the ex-boyfriend and girlfriend “there are so many errors, and many omissions. There is inconsistency in the grounds for judgement, which brings us to nothing.”

“It is as if they had ruled ex novo [anew] on Meredith’s murder” added the Deputy Prosecutor, Giancarlo Costagliola, “basing their decision solely on the arguments of the defence.”

“Normally the appeal judge evaluates the reasoning procedure of the first-instance judge and compares it to new elements. But this one missed that out altogether: there is no comparison between the checks carried out in the first and second instances. Only what was carried out during the appeal was evaluated.”

Only defence arguments were taken heed of For the magistrates, in fact, the second-level judges “took heed, almost exclusively, of the arguments of the defence consultants or the reconstruction hypotheses that were largely to the benefit of the defense theses”.

The prosecutors who authored the appeal [to Cassation] also criticized the “method used”. “The first-instance verdict”, they wrote, “was summarized in just a few lines”,

“The verdict [which we] challenge completely ignored all the other aspects which corresponded with the accusation’s hypothesis, all the aspects which, on the contrary - as was seen in the reasoning report of the first-instance verdict - had been rigorously pointed out and considered by the Assizes Court [trial court] in its decision.”

“In examining the individual [items of] evidence, the challenged sentence has fallen into consistent procedural error in the weaknesses and evident illogicality of the grounds for its decision.”

Prejudice For the General Prosecution magistrates, the second-level [first appeal] judges appear to have shown “a sort of prejudice” with the “infelicitous preamble of the judge [the author], who is supposed to be impartial”, when he declared that “nothing is certain except the death of Meredith Kercher”, which to the others [Mr Galati and Mr Costagliola] is nothing more than “a resounding preview/forecast of the judgement” and a “disconcerting” affirmation.
The ten points The reasons for the appeal to Cassation which Perugia’s General Prosecution presented today against the acquittal verdict of Amanda and Raffaele are based on ten points of the second-level verdict.

The first is the lack of grounds for the decision, in the decree of 18 December 2010, to allow the forensic testimony/expert witness in the appeal judgement.

The second, in contrast, concerns a contrary decision: the decision to not allow a new forensic investigation requested by the prosecution at the end of the ruling discussion. In the appeal to Cassation it is written that the Appeal Court’s rejection reveals “contradictoriness/contrariness and demonstrates manifest illogicality in the grounds for the judgement/reasoning report”.

The other points deal with the decision by the Appeal court of Assizes of Perugia to not hear the witness Aviello, also the definition of “unreliable” [in the Hellman Report] with reference to the witnesses Roberto Quintavalle and Antonio Curatolo, also the time of death of Meredith Kercher, also on the genetic investigations.

As well as the analyses of the prints and other traces, also the presence of Amanda and Sollecito in via della Pergola, also the simulation of a crime [the staged break-in], and also the exclusion of the aggravating circumstance of the crime of “calumny”.

Missing assumption/acceptance of decisive evidence In the appeal to Cassation there is also mention of the “missing assumption/acceptance of a decisive proof”

In other words, of that proof [presented at trial court] which consisted of “the carrying out of the genetic analysis on the sample taken from the knife by the experts appointed by the Court during the appeal judgement, who did not carry out the analyses of that sample, thus violating a specific request contained in the [orders given to them] when they were assigned to the expert-witness post”

“In the second-level [Hellman] verdict”, the magistrates said, “the judges sought to refer to this in their own way, by speaking of an “experimental method” by which these tests/checks could be carried out.

But this is not the case”, said Deputy Chief Prosecutor Giancarlo Costagliola: “Dr Novelli [the prosecution’s DNA consultant at appeal] spoke of cutting-edge technology, not of experimental methods”.

So Dr Galati, himself formerly a deputy chief prosecutor at the Supreme Court who for years handled nothing but Supreme Court cases and knows what constitutes a sound appeal argument, argued that Judge Hellman had made ten serious mistakes. (Aviello claimed in court that he had been bribed; instead of investigating, Judge Hellman very quickly move on.)

But even worse, that Judge Hellman had illegally vastly expanded the scope of the appeal. And he had illegally appointed the independent DNA experts.

Because of Hellman’s alleged sloppiness and overreach, the defenses now stood to lose EVERYTHING they thought they had gained - and had been so noisily jubilant about, especially to the media in the US. An arrogance not taken kindly to in Italy at all.

5. Fast forward to English language press reports of the past few days.

Nick Squires may have been the first to carry the report quoting unnamed sources in the Daily Telegraph.

Two prosecutors in Perugia, where Miss Kercher was murdered, face accusations of wasting 182,000 euros (£150,000) of public money by commissioning a controversial 3D video which purported to show how the murder unfolded.

The contentious video, which defence lawyers said was based on circumstantial evidence, showed Miss Kercher being held down and stabbed to death by Miss Knox and her two co-accused.

The Leeds University student and her alleged murderers were represented in the 20 minute film by animated ‘avatars’. It was played on a big screen to the judge and jury in the original trial in 2009.

The National Audit Office is now investigating the prosecutors, Giuliano Mignini and his deputy, Manuela Comodi, on whether the video was a necessary part of their case.

If found culpable they could have to pay the money back to the prosecutors’ office.

Really? Accusations? Wasting? Controversial? Purported? Contentious? Now investigating?

Note that Nick Squires didnt name his sources. He didnt explain why he claimed the video simulation was controversial. (It wasn’t at all controversial at trial in 2009.) He didnt seem to know who had made the accusations or how or when they had been made or to who. 

He failed to mention that the video was played behind closed doors, and that the defenses had no comeback to it. He said it depicted Knox, though in fact it deliberately didn’t. He didn’t explain that the depiction of the fight lasted 15 minutes. He didn’t explain that the depiction of three attackers was overwhelmingly convincing to Judge Massei and his jury.

Nick Squires’s report was nevertheless comparatively brief and restrained in contrast to that of Michael Day which came next. His very much embroidered version was published in the UK Independent.  The accusatory tone and serious charges in Nick Squires’s and Michael Day’s reports were then picked up without checking by a large number of American and European media outlets.

See the reports here and here and here and here and here and here and here .

Note that not one of these reports was checked out in Italy, and that all these reports slam Mr Mignini (yet again) and indicate that this was an OFFICIAL accusation of “wasting public funds”.  Many US reports wrongly state that the British audit office is investigating.

Michael Day claimed that “Agostino Chiappiniello has said he suspects the two of inappropriately spending €182,000 (£148,000) on a crude and cartoonish 20-minute video,” 

Really? Agostino Chiappiniello, did you tell Michael Day precisely that?

Michael Day then states that “In both trials [Mr Mignini’s ] interventions were notable for the outlandish motivations and personality traits he attributed to the defendants. He promoted the idea that the murder was the result of a sex-game that got out of control, despite having little or no evidence to support the theory.”

Really? Actually Guede and Knox and Sollecito were all CONVICTED of a sex crime at trial, because to their judges and juries that is what the evidence inescapably pointed to.

And Michael Day concludes with yet another misleading statement (see above on Dr Galati’s appeal for the correct facts which he seriously garbles here.):

Judges at the Cassation court may only overturn the first-appeal verdict on technical grounds. Thus, no new evidence may be introduced and the prosecution’s room for manoeuvre is limited. The pair could not be retried for the same crimes.

Really? But nobody is talking about the pair being retried for the same crimes. This does not arise. Under Italian law they STILL stand accused of the same crimes as they were before trial back in 2009 until the Supreme Court signs off on their case.

6. Fast-forward to the ITALIAN reports of the past two days

Translation by our main poster Jools from an Umbria24 report, posted on Wednesday, which tells a very different story. 

[There was several months ago]”¦ a complaint from “a group of private citizens” who did not sign their names and surnames about an alleged misuse of public money….

No comment from the two prosecutors of Perugia, no comment on this news.

As we have learned the prosecutors have not received any legal papers regarding the investigation and they heard of the news from the press.

Who will pay? To decide if the expense was adequate for the State coffers will be the task of the prosecutor at the Court of Audits of Umbria.

Meanwhile if the Supreme Court were to overturn the judgment of the Perugia appellate court, the costs would be paid by the two accused [Knox and Sollecito].

If instead the Supreme Court were to confirm the acquittal, the bill for 182 thousand euros would be borne by the Italian State.

7. In summation

Quite a fizzle. The prosecutors are NOT quaking in their boots. They didnt even know about it.  And the full force of Italian justice does NOT have them under the microscope. 

  • The anonymous complaint was filed over two months ago.  Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.
  • If the enquiry is actually pursued (not at all certain)  then it is Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito who could in fact be stuck for the costs (plus VAT) of producing the video. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.
  • The Corte dei Conti is not the equivalent of a criminal or civic court, it is essentially an investigating tribunal. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.
  • The Corte dei Conti has so far not accused anyone of anything, and it may never do so. It sure doesn’t seem to regard the matter as urgent. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.
  • In fact it has taken over two months to, well… not even assemble the evidence or bother to get in touch with Mr Mignini or Ms Comodi. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.

On the same basis Judge Hellman could in theory be accused of incurring TWO huge cost over-runs.

  • One for running his appeal court only on saturdays to suit just one defense lawyer, when the overtime costs to Italy became huge - substantially more than the cost of the video. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.
  • And one for (according to Dr Galati) illegally appointing the two DNA consultants - the costs of that investigation to Italy became much more than the cost of the video. Nick Squires and Michael Day sure did not make that clear.

The reconstruction video is so powerful and accurate that it could,  if it is watched by the Supreme Court in Rome or a new appeal court in Perugia, be quite devastating to the defense of the two accused. This is because it depicts the full cruelty of the attack on Meredith - and it shows that THREE people had to have attacked her.

So who filed the anonymous complaint against Mr Mignini and Ms Comodi? And who used Nick Squires and Michael Day as puppets to make a private claim look official, and make that hoax go viral?  We are sure Dr Galati will have all the answers before many days go past. Calunnia charges might apply.

Someone must REALLY fear that Sollecito and Knox will be cooked if that video reconstruction ever gets shown again. Case closed? At one stroke.

[Below: Knox and Sollecito, who could be billed over $300,000 for the reconstruction video]


This just made my day 😊

Posted by Sara on 05/05/12 at 04:27 AM | #

Are we seeing the influence of the Marriot PR firm on these editors here?
If not then what do the PR firm actually and specifically do exactly?

Posted by Black Dog on 05/05/12 at 05:02 AM | #

One little chip at a time. What these people don’t realize, or worst still don’t want to, is the simple fact that we will never go away but keep on chipping through the stone wall they have erected against the truth. We will never stop for as long as it takes.
Sincerely Grahame Rhodes

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/05/12 at 05:44 AM | #

What I find bewildering is the personal attacks/character distortion that appears to be the norm from “the other side”. Whilst PMF and this site are focussing on facts supported by credible sources and documents, and legal folk, this is not the case elsewhere. Yet, elsewhere seems to be having a wonderful smudging effect on this case to make it appear that their personal and unnecessary attacks are actually observations.

Yet another excellent article. I only wish that the media did their research so thoroughly, rather than leaving lots of winks and nods in unreferenced, unsubstantiated articles. (Feel free, Media, to defend yourself and raise your game by all means!)

My recommendation to all on this site is to disengage debating with the usual suspects and focus attention on what actually matters - the next trial and supporting the Kerchers.

Posted by TruthWillOut on 05/05/12 at 09:42 AM | #

Hi TruthWillOut,

It’s impossible to have a rational discussion with Amanda Knox’s supporters. They just regurgitate the same FOA myths, claim there was a huge, sinister conspiracy to frame Knox and Sollecito and give you a detailed and definitive eyewitness account of Amanda Knox’s questioning on 5 November 2007.

It’s more productive to contact journalists about their horribly biased, one-sided and error-ridden reports. Twitter is an excellent way of doing this; it’s quick and convenient. We have the contact details of literally hundreds of journalists. I encourage everyone to demand factually accurate and balanced reporting. Too many journalists have relied almost exclusively on Amanda Knox’s family and supporters and PR creep David Marriott for information.

Posted by The Machine on 05/05/12 at 11:03 AM | #

In answer to both of you. It’s obvious that the only recourse these people have is vitriol, lies and just simple bad manners. They have nothing else because for them to stop for a moment and really try to be dispassionate then they would obviously see what they refuse to and that is the truth of all the evidence. but no they will trot out the lone perpetrator theory which has been dis-proven countless times, not to mention Knox is her own words. Point is except for a few lunatic fringe the majority will eventually see through the P/R. I had this argument the other day with someone who insisted that in fact there had never been any P/R movement at all. This is representative of the mind set of these people.

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/05/12 at 12:21 PM | #

It’s rather surprising that not one journalist has twigged that the other really big story here *is* the PR campaign and how it has controlled most of the reporting.The issue is HUGE and everyone should be very angry indeed to have been lied to.

No, you can’t have a reasonable debate with vandals who are present because they are *paid* to spread the defense lies and smear those who oppose them, but they should be challenged wherever possible.

Truth and true justice for Meredith and the world.

Posted by bucketoftea on 05/05/12 at 03:36 PM | #

Without going into the nitty-gritties of the investigations, it is well understood that the investigators follow many leads and some of them may turn out to be blind. Yes, expenditure is a serious bottleneck (even in the US) and we are required to follow only reasonable leads.

The criminals do not have any restrictions, but investigators must follow the law and rules of the land to the dot. It is unfair to complaint about the cost of a video (I presume that proper procedures must have been followed) and the complainant must come out clean on his motives. I have only one question: did he receive any money from aborad (directly or indirectly) and encouraged to lodge the complaint? He cannot hide behind annoymity.

What I Tell You Three Times Is True

Posted by chami on 05/05/12 at 05:09 PM | #

I agree about the futility of debating with FOAkers. I have realized since long that they are not interested in truth or logic and will most definitely resort to personal attacks if challenged. Yet I cannot stop myself sometimes when I see them self-congratulating and agreeing with each other based on fake claims and sometimes, pure nonsense. The latest nonsense that seems to be circulating around is that Guede’s DNA was found on 400 samples gathered in the room. It is so frustrating when you see such comments because I start feeling that anyone who visits these forums without adequate knowledge of the case is bound to be influenced. I mean, if someone told me that a guy’s DNA was found on 400 samples and there were 0 samples of the other two, it’s obvious what I would think. And then of course are the attacks on the Kercher family. I keep chipping in hoping to convince at least a few people but usually end up feeling depressed myself :(. It is tough to keep quiet but it is equally tough to deal with such hatred.

Posted by Sara on 05/05/12 at 06:34 PM | #

Yes Sara Hatred is all they have

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/05/12 at 08:38 PM | #

Hi bucketoftea,

Amanda Knox’s family and David Marriott have controlled most of the reporting. Just like Amanda Knox, Curt Knox, Edda and Chris Mellas have lied repeatedly. It defies belief that they have managed to pull the wool over the eyes of hundreds of journalists who have accepted everything they say as the Gospel truth.

The fact these journalists are prepared to believe palpable nonsense such as incriminating DNA floated on a specks of dust, Knox and Sollecito were framed by corrupt police officers so Italy could save face or Knox had a vision that Lumumba killed Meredith speaks volumes about their naivety and stupidity.

Posted by The Machine on 05/05/12 at 09:17 PM | #

Thinking more about the increasingly toxic PR campaign because of the great comments above.

Such campaigns are NOT a good trend because they chill witnesses and dissuade experts and demoralize police and delegitimize prosecutors and whole governments, and ultimately stop society functioning and political and economic processes happening. People can literally get away with murder when these campaigns succeed and there is ultimately a growing cost to ALL of us.

All of that has happened in this case, no thanks to toxic idiots like Steve Moore and David Anderson and Bruce Fischer. Their primary gig is to destroy people rather than meet in the middle on a best way forward. Not only has Mignini been demonized, try to name one witness or cop or prosecutor or judge (or reporter) who is no worse off as a result of Meredith’s case. Thank goodness we now have Dr Galati, who is tracking the toxic campaign and acting against it.

All of us here and on PMF who accept to be publicly named have been attacked and seen wildly wrong stories made up. (An imprisonable felony, by the way, to wrongly accuse others of crimes as they have often done, and doing that anonymously is a sign of felonious intent.) The lead attacker against us was for long Bruce Fischer. As the anonymous “Bruce Fisher of New York” he hyperinflated his own persona, and posted many felony defamations - until police and our investigators found him to be a complete nobody. We could not believe our freaking eyes (click the “Bruce Fisher” in the right column to reveal the sorry truth about this untalented guy.).

They say always follow the money. I dont think that quite works in explaining this cruel murder or this toxic campaign, although money and status are a part of it. To understand the unique ferocity of the PR campaign I think we are best served by following the primal rages.

These are rages that boil away like a toxic cauldron, diminish careers, and often shorten lifetimes and sometime bring the house down around them. My take is that 4 or 5 primeval rages are driving the campaign here, and without any one of them the PR campaign would have been far more moderate. A perfect storm.

I dont think I myself see Amanda Knox herself driven by primeval rage. She is damaged, we have little doubt, because the psychological tests in Capanne in 2008 strongly showed that - there was a real fear that she could kill again - and she was quirky growing up. But I think her mind is mostly a cold confused thing, the product of someone else’s primal anger. She remains of course untreated. 

And Sollecito? Truly psychopathic? Some people really are born that way. Either with psychopathia or the deadly occasional strain of Aspergers’. He had every break, but instead seemed to enjoy the murder he had long fantasized about. Cold mind - but not primal rage driven?

Posted by Peter Quennell on 05/06/12 at 06:39 PM | #

Just a thought, has anyone ever thought of contacting African American groups about the obvious racism in the PR campaign. I am not doubting Rudy’s involvement in this crime, yet to me it seems that the PR campaign is using the black stereotype and creating lies about Rudy to push the idea that since there was a black guy involved he had to do it, because black people commit crimes. For example, Steve Moore has said Rudy was a drug dealer and did 5-6 crimes a month which is a complete lie. I also think the obvious racism in the PR campaign is doing damage to Blacks, its more or less opening up the door that blaming the black guy is ok. Just a thought.

Posted by Severino518 on 05/06/12 at 07:49 PM | #

Hi Guys, just taking a break from reading ‘Meredith’, there’s a lovely comment on already awarding 5*s. I wonder how it’s selling and if K & S will read it? I’d bet Edda and Curt won’t be able to help themselves!!

Posted by Melanie on 05/06/12 at 10:13 PM | #

Didn’t know Knox could read actually and Sollecito only confines himself to books with pictures (Manga comics etc;)

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/07/12 at 03:27 AM | #

Sorry Grahame, I beg to differ.  According to the PR, Amanda Knox is an individual of such high intellect mere mortals like us could not possibly comprehend.

She is multi lingual, (although her Italian language skills while being interviewed by the police as a witness were apparently akin to anyone having watched an episode of The Sopranos), she is well read and conversant in all the classics, and of course she is a straight A honors student (isn’t she Edda?)

Her alibi email home is testament to this as well as her subsequent scrawlings.(Wot? you cant see that?)

Sollecito on the other hand has not had the PR firm working to paper over his large cracks and therefore still appears in the media as the tool he always was. Oh, and he went to see Judge Heavey in Seattle too recently, but never saw Knox although they live a few blocks away from each other.

Posted by Black Dog on 05/07/12 at 07:53 AM | #

Thank You black Dog.

I stand corrected and upon closer examination there is only one possible conclusion. Amanda Knox is from another planet who has beamed down to save the human race. With her lone and trusted sidekick Raphael the masked rider of the plains led the fight for law and order in the early West. Oh sorry I seem to have warped into another space time continuum with the Lone Ranger. Never mind. I promise to be good and sit in the corner for a while.

Speaking of which the best way to deal with the FOAKers (An unfortunate choice of acronym) is with a huge belly laugh. That is every time they trot out their garbage which passes for garbage

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/07/12 at 02:03 PM | #

Primal rages are not something I ever noticed in top people in the market economies. They are too offputting to create a groundswell of support.

Optimism is what most people want, as we saw yesterday in the election in France, and most top people tend to exude that. Full-blown conspiracies are rare among them, although they sometime game the system for all it is worth.

Psychologists like Steven Pinker suggest people are born with a mental blank slate. Minds could develop in any way. Primal rages emerge either in childhood through abuse or abandonment or a little later in life out of status frustrations.

One of our psychologists suggests that Curt Knox might exhibit abandonment rage (maybe then causing the same in Amanda) whereas Doug Preston, Bruce Fischer and David Marriott might be exhibiting status rage, along with many or most of the groupies.

I think its impossible to isolate such a large group and hope they just shut up. My guess is that many or most would be amenable to some helping back in from the limb they are on, and/or amenable to some third way forward.

I would like the psychological tests on AK and RS done in 2008 to be made public and psychologists to examine and weight them so we know what we are dealing with here. They apparently werent pretty but they could also have been wrong. Ak and RS dont seem full-blown snapped, and a full-blown diminished capacity defense was never in the cards. But getting the symptoms in front of the jury that both families long seemed to know about might have won them some leniency points along with proper treatment.

I would also like to see Curt Knox rethink his role and stop taking out his primal anger on the whole world. Ultimately he drives all of the PR and he has never ever told anyone to chill it. Even Chris Mellas once told him to cool it from Perugia - and Curt angrily blew him off in the press.

In his latest book Steven Pinker argues that the general global population trend is for us to become nicer (I for one observe that, except when economic status is wittingly destroyed) but he also argues that there is an odd trade-off. We increasingly like to dwell on the dark side and soak up and propagate conspiracy theories.

Okay with that just so long as we dont take that alternate reality too literally as many have been doing here.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 05/07/12 at 03:32 PM | #

Thank you Peter as always.
However in AK and RS case don’t forget the element of drug taking where cold sober they might hesitate, but under the influence of drugs any feelings or control of emotions were depressed to the point of being nonexistent.

Sollecito and Knox were into coke of that there can be no doubt since coke increases the mental and physical rush of sex which is right up Knox street after all. (Don’t forget that Guide was not there because they considered him to be a nice guy but as a supplier.) Any inhibitions therefore would have gone out the window and since both were/are mentally unstable to begin with drugs would have taken them both over the edge into a killing rage. Remember the phrase ‘Blood Simple’

It was only later when they sobered up that the truth sank in hence the duvet and they had at least eight hours to clean up as well. People forget the little details such as the lamp or the infamous bathroom mat shuffle.

Preston Fisher and Marriot are representative of mentally deficient human beings anyway because their level of denial is palpable. ie they would do anything but admit they might even be just slightly wrong. Similar denials must have been rampant when it was proven that the earth was round instead of flat or that the earth went round the sun or that Knox and Sollecito were (and still are always to remain so.) guilty.

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/07/12 at 07:51 PM | #

Hi Grahame.

Yeah the drug pointed to at trial was indeed cocaine, and Ak had a mobile phone # for a cocaine dealer in her phone. AK and RS both admitted they were stoned - again and again in fact. Sollecito said he swore off drugs because of this.

I know some on PMF are iffy about accrediting too much to drugs because they are concerned it can take away from the responsibility and they want to see the perps serve the full terms.

Drugs sure dont melt many US judges’ hearts. Judge Micheli gave the perps no breaks at all. Judge Massei gave them some (accrediting Guede as prime mover, saying the moved duvet showed humanity). Novice criminal judge Hellman melted altogether.

With luck some no-nonsense judge like Micheli presides over any new appeal trial, and preferably there should be no jury.

That jury at first appeal level really needs to go. They cause bad outcomes again and again and again. Thank goodness Cassation usually whacks them down.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 05/07/12 at 08:19 PM | #

Thank you Peter once more. Yes we can only hope. As I sometimes point out to these believers in fairy tales of innocence We are not going away and we will not be silenced. In fact it amuses me that I am always deleted on these sites but never challenged. They have blocked me altogether on such abysmal losing blogs such as’Ground Report’ which is indicative of the fact that they can’t take it only dish it out. That only confirms to me just what cowards they are.

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/07/12 at 11:19 PM | #

Pete, I agree with you that Curt Knox is full of rage. I don’t know why or how I know this. I guess I just read it in his face. His response to the reporters after AK’s conviction (“Hell, no!”) was typical.

Posted by Earthling on 05/08/12 at 08:15 AM | #

Of course he’s full of rage. Someone has had the quintessential temerity to question him, or at the very least his veracity. if you’re reading this Curt go and ask Amanda or Edda the meaning of quintessential, veracity and temerity. Amanda should do OK after all she’s a straight A student.

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/08/12 at 04:20 PM | #

Hi Earthling. Curt Knox’s primal rage is well documented if not (yet) that public except around Seattle. He once held the record for Worst Deadbeat Dad in America and if THAT rejection didn’t screw up his oldest daughter’s psychology…

He keeps going the way he’s going and egging on the extreme aggression against the Italians and Meredith’s family and we here, and it is likely to all flow out in spades. Chris Mellas and Ted Simon should try once again to hogtie him.

Posted by Peter Quennell on 05/08/12 at 04:51 PM | #

Grahame wrote: “We are not going away and we will not be silenced.” Amen, tell it like it is, brother!

Peter: Curt was almost criminal in his neglect of his first family (in fact, it probably WAS borderline criminal, what he did). Any sympathy I feel for his daughter (which is small) always stems from that. Being that he’s adopted himself, he probably has abandonment issues of his own, but that doesn’t excuse him passing it on to his kids.

Thanks for this article. It clearly explains a lot of what’s happening now in the media and the courts. As usual, here in America, they only tell us the propaganda they want us to hear.

Posted by Earthling on 05/09/12 at 12:04 AM | #

Curt seems like a sad sad sad man, though I really don’t appreciate his lack of respect for Italian society and culture, and find his obvious xenophobia and lack of culture to be another issue with the man.

Posted by Severino518 on 05/09/12 at 01:53 AM | #

Speaking of which…... What ever happened to Steve Moore or has he dropped out of sight and let his sorry slack mouthed excuse for a wife take over?
Boy!!! I’m feeling nasty about this today. Strange to relate though I still am, on occasion, taken up with feeling of great anger about how they managed to (So far) get away with it.. But then that’s me.
Very best to everyone and as always fight the good fight.
Thank you Peter

Posted by Grahame Rhodes on 05/09/12 at 03:47 AM | #

Incredibly informative articles lately - thanks to all who worked on them.  I learned quite a bit of new information and I thought I already knew it all.  Dr. Galati’s report seems incredibly convincing and he appears highly intelligent and experienced so will be a formidable prosecutor when this goes back to trial as I now do expect it will, unless pigs fly again.

I only take exception to one comment by Peter Quennell (amongst many many other well written and informative comments/articles) and that is the following:

“Either with psychopathia or the deadly occasional strain of Aspergers’. He had every break, but instead seemed to enjoy the murder he had long fantasized about.”

I have some family members with Aspergers, have studied a lot about it too, and there is no reason to imagine that people with Aspergers are more violent or inclined to murder anyone.  In fact they are usually very sensitive, but just do not know how to interact with other people in social situations.  They try hard but end up being awkward or saying something ridiculous and then are ostracized.  So they suffer a lot from this problem.  Most of them want to make friends but just are really poor at social skills.

A sociopath would be more likely - someone who thinks that they can get away with things and feels above usual rules of conduct.  Then there are the drugs, especially if cocaine (crack cocaine??) were involved which could easily make people get violent.

Posted by believing on 05/10/12 at 06:18 AM | #

Here is a highly misleading post by Frank Sfarzo whipping up the FOAK dummies into a lather, in which he slimes Mignini once again and misses the entire point of the video.

There was NO investigation, merely an anonymous tip, maybe from Frank Sfarzo or David Anderson, and no action was taken.

The complex highly effective video was shown in closed court because the Kerchers had requested that such evidence be kept private.

The defense was simply left stunned. Did he get ANYTHING right?!

Posted by Peter Quennell on 09/29/12 at 06:45 AM | #
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